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Poll: Does Sony Have the Right to Put a Rootkit on your PS3?

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• Yes, definitely.
• NO! that's insane.
• Don't know. Don't care.
• What PS3 rootkit?!


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Official PS3 firmware v3.56 has a rootkit



[UPDATE ABOUT PS3 ROOTKIT HERE]

According to developer Mathieulh, the official PS3 firmware v3.56 is said to contain a rootkit which allow Sony to perform remote code execution upon connection to the PlayStation network. What this means is that Sony can scan for specific files on your PS3 console—such as custom firmwares and hombrew applications—and send a report back to the company. Whether this is legal or not is yet to be determined but be careful what you put on your PS3.

Originally Posted by N.A:
For those who are curious about the new PS3 security, it seems Sony has implemented something in 3.56 I mentioned here a few weeks ago that is the same as Microsoft uses to detect and ban 360's.

Mathieulh just posted about it on IRC.

Essentially Sony can now remotely execute code on the PS3 as soon as you connect. This can do whatever Sony wants it to do such as verifying system files or searching for homebrew. Sony can change the code and add new detection methods without any firmware updates and as the code executes remotely there is no reliable way to forge the replies.

Whilst it is possible to patch or remove this code from the firmware this will likely mean the end of playing CFW online (as PSN can just check before login that this is active) or at the very least mean it will be even easier for Sony to detect and ban users.

Judging from the fact that people can still connect using the proxy method it seems Sony hasn't activated any of this yet but the functions are there in the new firmware.

Originally Posted by IRC:
Jan 27 14:44:32 3.56 has nice new stuffs in there :P
Jan 27 14:44:43 like remote code execution upon login
Jan 27 14:44:45 They will just release patches so people who have hacked cant go online
Jan 27 14:44:46 yummy :P
Jan 27 14:44:50 WAT
Jan 27 14:45:00 RFE built-in the fw!?
Jan 27 14:45:25 3.56 pretty much has a built in psn rootkit
Jan 27 14:45:30 dude, that's the only stuff i'd be afraid of
Jan 27 14:45:31 don't tell me I haven't warned you
Jan 27 14:45:43 psn rootkit ?
Jan 27 14:46:05 but if we could rip-off the fw that shit would be erased
Jan 27 14:46:20 that was the only thing stopped sony to _auto_ update your fw
Jan 27 14:46:22 noone it's not that simple
Jan 27 14:46:29 the server awaits a proper reply
Jan 27 14:46:34 and that reply isn't in the firmware


source neogaf.com via psx-scene.com

58 comments:

  1. Watching this ongoing crap from Sony long ago convinced me to stop giving them money. I bought a secondhand PS3 from a friend for our kids to play games and to watch Netflix movies. It would be nice if the POS supported PS2 games like the original PS3s, but it doesn't. It would be nice if I could store DVDs on the hard drive so they don't get scratched up by the kids, but I can't. This is why I have a PC for gaming and multimedia. The PS3 is a joke. If you MUST own a console system, know that you are buying into a closed system and the manufacturer will rape you if you decide to do anything with it outside of that system. If you want freedom, buy or build a PC and put LINUX on it.

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  2. The problem with PC gaming is there aren't many games designed for a PC connected to a television. Most are designed for a PC on a desk, and players 2, 3, and 4 have to use separate PCs and separate copies of the game.

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  3. sorry the PS3 is a joke?
    the xbox360 also has this buddy...

    i don't get why people are so sad and pathetic about this.

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  4. OP is a moron. The 360 doesn't execute code to ban you, they just block your MAC and console ID.

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  5. sorry the xbox360 does exactly the same thing, 100% identical.

    heck if you have a kinect or a mic connected to your xbox360 the EULA says Microsoft is allowed to record any audio it wants (but sony is truly evil here)

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  6. Why would you want to play on a tv? It's almost always low res crap.

    Unless you mean a flat panel TV, but all those are is blown up monitors. Hell most of them have VGA, DVI or some form of HDMI connector. Also with USB controllers you can have as many people connected as the software will allow. Honestly there is no reason on Earth you should HAVE to run a console to play a game. The only thing you gain by running a console is the initial cheapness of the hardware. However then your spending $60 on new releases or dealing with that lovely gray second hand market.

    No thank you, I am sticking with my PC and steam/d2d/GoG for my gaming fix.

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    Replies
    1. "most of them have VGA, DVI or some form of HDMI connector"
      Except most people who aren't geeks don't know that their TV has VGA or that a DVI out can be connected to an HDMI in.

      "Also with USB controllers you can have as many people connected as the software will allow."
      Which brings up the problem of PC game developers cutting features out of what "the software will allow" either A. because they don't anticipate any TV hookups (see previous point) or B. just to make more money selling more copies to each household. See the article "The 7 Commandments All Video Games Should Obey" by David Wong.

      "I am sticking with my PC and steam/d2d/GoG"
      How many games on steam/d2d/GoG support gamepads at all, let alone two to four gamepads on a single PC?

      Delete
  7. well... why doesn't anyone look at the packet log coming from the router instead instead of relying on an IRC conversation to conspirate ?

    Proof is the answer

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  8. Technically its not a rootkit (the jailbreak is a rootkit), its a antirookit.

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  9. Technically, you are all idiots. Stop breaking into things and then you won't have to worry. Don't copy software illegally you retards.

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  10. @ Merle: I agree with you, except the 'idiots' part.

    If people would stop breaking into videogames to make them work as a fucking PC, instead of buying the aforementioned fucking PC, there would be no worries.

    Instead, we see things like "Oh, look, I can run (choose: windows/linux/nuclear bombs targeting systems/whatever) on my PS3! 1337! OMG Ponies!"

    So if you want to run whatever it is, why dont you use your stupid PC for that?

    Talk about going the long way.

    On the other hand, I honestly think that jailbreaking an Iphone is ok... the damn thing shouldn't be locked in the first place.

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  11. @ Merle,
    I BUY something, then I do not see a reason, why the manufacturer has any right to tell me what to do withit as long as I don't interfear with their business.
    How would you react, if BMW told you with your new 530d you are only allowed to buy fuel at Shell.
    BTW: I do not pirate copy!!! I make backup copies for my own protection (I do not pass them on!!!
    The only idiot around here is you!!!
    If sony told you to jump of the cliffs to play the PS3 you would probably do that too (man would taht be great!!!)

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  12. @merle
    umm not everyone who breaks a device's drm does so to play pirated games. most want to run their own software(homebrew) or do neat things like cluster them to make a cheap but very effective cpu cluster.

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  13. So you would need a rootkit-rootkit, that runs the sony-code in a sandbox and let it think your system is untouched.

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  14. The problem here is with people like MegaMOK who make themselves sound like spoiled little brats who think they can do whatever they want to a product they buy as if laws don't exist and TOA don't exist and companies trying to secure their product so people don't hack it.

    "I BUY something, then I do not see a reason, why the manufacturer has any right to tell me what to do withit as long as I don't interfear with their business."

    Spoiled-Brat. Textbook example.

    You bought a product of SONY, and USING Sony's product you must listen agree to their TOA by buying their product you should at least assume that they don't want you fucking with their product, instead you and every other similar person who obnoxiously feels they have to have EVERYTHING free, everything must work as THEY want it to and will do everything they can to get what they want and pamper themselves.

    I bought a PS3 not to god damn whine about OHHH NOESSS, IT DOESNT PLAY TEH SUPER NINTENDO GAMES, U SUCK SONY1!1!1 I HAET YOU SO MUCH THAT IMMA ILLEGALLY DOWNLOAD GAMES AND NOT SUPPORT HARD-WORKING DEVELOPERS TEHE...

    Laws/Rules exist not to bind you but to show you your freedoms, learn that lesson well, the more you fight the stricter things become which is evident with Sony's actions against the hackers and spoiled 'kiddies' who think they can have and get whatever they want because they're somehow 'Special'.

    You buy a PS3? It's Sony's product FOR YOU, it's still Their product that you bought, its features, abilities, free online gaming, PS3 games, internet browser are there for YOU to enjoy, not to god damn exploit, find loop-holes and scheme at how you can do more with it illegally just for your own amusement or pathetic gains.

    I hate these jailbreakers, hackers, people who whine about 'Sony breaking the laws of our freedoms' bullshit, when all the jailbreakers and Geohotz had done was find a loophole in the freedoms given to us and exploit it against companies like Apple and Sony and get away with it when the reality of all logic and common sense should be in favor of the companies.

    I bought my PS3 to enjoy the exclusives, to support Sony to keep making things for me, to support games that are only on the PS3, am not even a fanboy but I know what crosses the line of Right and Wrong.

    People, grow a pair, if you want modding-rights and make crazy shit or to mod games and make silly videos, silly programs, fucking just get a PC and do it.

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  15. Also, funny to note the obvious, the only ones who'd whine about this rootkit, are paranoid delinquents who think it'd somehow magically effect their legit PS3's and ruin their games, saves, break or brick their PS3 for no reason so they procrastinate and make bullshit excuses to have grudges against Sony when there is nothing to fear UNLESS you're fucking around with the console which is just one of the smallest rules that apply if you agree and accept the terms of buying a console, stop crying babies. I have lots of delicious PS3 exclusives like Demons' Souls, I CAN play online without fearing of being banned, I don't even pay for online fees! I like many others, don't give a shit if Other OS is missing, I don't have to dig around for loopholes on how to exploit products I own to arrogantly think that it 100% belongs to me when I am not ignorant to believe such bullshit and No you're not a victim for buying a product/PS3 and not being able to do 'Everything' on it.

    Again, Spoiled brats.

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  16. I'm not renting my PS3, I OWN it. I should not have to break anything just to run my own code on it...

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  17. ^ You 'Own' SONY's Product, until I see it saying 'Gão's Playstation 3(trademark) beyond just a username, then you are just another example of a spoiled brat :)

    I can't wait to see how many more show up. Why they think they have to do everything on it, 'run your own code' on it, it's a damn gaming console for christs sake, rofl. You play PS3 games on it, not nerd it out with shit cause you feel you CAAAAN and think that nothing should stop you.

    FUCK DIS SHIT I WANNA PLAY 360 GAMES ON IT TOO CUZ I SHOULDNT HAVE TO BUY 2 FUCKIN SEPARATE CONSOLES! FUK U $ONY AND MICRO$OFT, STEALIN MY RIGHTS AND FREEDUMZ!

    Daaaammnnn!

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  18. You know what?! Fuck owning this Asus G73 gaming laptop! I WANT IT TO PLAY PS3 GAMES TOO, I fuckin have a Blu-ray player on this laptop and I think Sonys' stealing my rights on not allowing me to fucking play Uncharted 2 on my fucking laptop! THOSE SCUM BAGS!

    As easy as it is to emulate all god damn consoles on a PC from NES to PS2 or Xbox, FUCK THAAAT! MAAAAAN!....I want my PS3 of all fuckin things to run it all, IF I CAN'T!....THEN SONY BE STEALING MY FREEDOMS! ITS MINE, ALL MINE! MY PRECCCIOUUUSSS!

    :/ anything else? I need new material. Also, I can't wait to play Dark Souls, it'll be on 360/PS3 (Demon's Souls spiritual successor) *DROOL* and it's of course a great game that requires that you can play online with the other people who own it and can play online!

    http://www.dotup.org/uploda/www.dotup.org1309882.jpg

    I came.

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  19. The cell processor has some great features. But unless sony is going to sell it separately with no strings, sony isn't offering me what I need. They are like crack dealers feeding addictions.

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  20. @Jason

    You know what. You need to stop being such an ass.
    Most of this cracking stemmed from Sony taking capabilities away from their console. People paid good money to have a console WITH those capabilities. I didn't see any mention of Sony sending out refunds when they took them away.
    How would you feel if you took your Geo Metro in for a service and when you went to pick it up the mechanic said, "Sorry Jason the company has decided that this car is not allowed to go on highways any more because that makes it too powerful, like running linux or something. Oh, they also decided you can't carry passengers in it now. Oh and the $800 stereo you put on, we had to take it out and throw it away because they don't like you playing CDs in here. Oh, we threw out your CD collection too. They decided all that CD capability was like playing PS2 games on a PS3"
    So how fair is that Jason. Now your mum has to walk to pick up her social security checks and all that money you invested is wasted now.
    Of course you won't complain because this is not a Jason Metro car. You bought it but it's not REALLY yours right.

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  21. Well, I understand why Sony is doing what they're doing. Which simply is to try and protect future revenue. I feel they DO have a right to do this. But I do agree that if you buy something you have the right to use it however you see fit even if that includes modification. That's the difference between ownership and renting/leasing. These modifications will not and should not ever be illegal.

    But that doesn't mean Sony isn't also within their rights to say "If you mod it, and we can detect it, we're not going to let you connect to our network." That's perfectly legitimate too since it is THEIR network and if that happens, a console modder will just have to suck it up and use their unit for local, non-networked uses unless they develop their own version of PSN and proxy to that.

    I don't mod my PS3, not because I'm against it though. There just are no benefits in doing it that would be a big enough boon for me to risk not being able to access PSN. I don't need to pirate games, I have a good career and can buy whatever I want. I could see some homebrew being beneficial though, something that enables you to access CIFS or NFS shares etc for easy media access without having to use the DLNA protocol would be nice. There may be homebrew that does this, I don't know as I haven't checked. Stuff like that I'd find nice... but I do have a Myth box that can do this so all it'd let me do is consolidate hardware. Not a big enough deal for me to potentially not be able to access PSN.

    To sum up... I support hacking consoles if you so choose since it's yours. I don't support piracy as that's half the reason why these consoles don't have extra network functionality that I'd actually like since companies try to limit the number of potentially exploitable components. I support Sony acting within their rights, banning use of PSN etc, litigating against actual piracy, but NOT litigating against hacks themselves.

    Just my opinion...

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  22. @Trash

    Well Trash, elaborate on what was taken away other than PS2 emulation and Other OS, people keep making a fuss over Other OS when the reality was that probably only 5% of PS3 owners used it, IT was taken away for the reason OF crackers because it was being used for such purposes, it was a liability.

    2 things, one being Because of crackers, so you mean to tell me that because PS3 emulation went away in older modders, that that gives people a right to whine and complain as if PS2 itself never existed? PS3 is out, sell your PS2's, you'll never find PS2's anywhere in the world! OMG rarities!? No. People used this to procrastinate the bullshit that they just wanted FREE games, people are cracking and seeking to jailbait for the primary reason of not having to buy games and use their money with the motive: "If I can get a game I want for free, why waste my money ever again?". I've dealt with co-workers who would say such ignorant and selfishness, Needs being mixed with greedy and bratty attitudes, blaming Sony for them doing what they're doing and ignoring the logic behind their actions, this is how it is in the end.

    Geohotz releasing the necessary tools for others 'isnt illegal' when common sense would say otherwise because EVERYONE would know what everyone's damn motives would be if they chose to use such a thing on their PS3, pirating games and being more greedy and money-grubbing than companies like Sony or Microsoft, Hah, seriously.

    Refunds for what? Like said before, people make such a huge deal over something so small, want to know when something is REALLY BAD? The news of Activision saying they'd close PS3 servers on COD Blackops so everyone who bought the game for multiplayer wouldn't be able to play online which is basically 80% of why anyone buys COD games. The reason to shut it down being their own inability to program and develop games on the PS3 and copy-pasting their 360-updates onto the PS3 effortlessly. Talentless hacks of employees using PS3's complexities to cover up their incompetence, comical... Sony removing emulation? Is a shame, I have a 60GB though so I don't care, many aren't so lucky sure, doesn't validate these actions against the PS3 for selfish desires.

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  23. @Trash again

    It's as Abe Lincoln once said, if you want to test a man's character, give him power. What power do I speak of? FREEDOMS. People exploit the freedoms they believe they still have so it must be taken away, rinse and repeat and you have humanity in a nutshell of trying to be sly and get away with things they shouldn't from trivial things to petty things and serious things. PS2 emulation came at the price for a financial point of view to lower the price to sell more units and to please everyone since the price was what was making it not sell well. $299 came and everyone shat bricks, though of course I would question why they can't just re-add it on, am sure they're just going to stick with Remastered-Games, it's awesome for them and awesome for certain consumers because I can't wait for SotC and Ico HD.

    Laughably, your comparisons are over-dramatized and one-sided in an unrealistic way so I'm just going to laugh at it really. You're over-exaggerating waaayyyy too much by that 'example/comparison', rofl. It's a freaking console a Gaming console, with little nice features that don't effect or cause a hindrance upon your life but are just eyecandy, oh noes, eyecandy was taken away I must....cry? RAGE? Seriously. As said before, it was a liability and many saw it happening because of the threat of hackers, Sony didn't want the same fate to happen to the PS3 like the PSP went so they're trying hard to prevent First-party developers from losing money from pirates, maybe LBP1 would officially sell 500K, 2 million other copies were pirated, Ohhh well.....Surely the studio would never go bankrupt, nor would I need to name all the many small studios that have died within the past 10 years....

    No more over-dramatized comparisons that are comical and silly please :\

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  24. Companies like Sony, do things to protect their own rights and make sure to do things from a financial perspective as well as whichever won't piss off the most consumers. It's either haters gonna hate, or just accept that things can and may happen.

    I will not agree with Sony like some blind and loyal fanboy and think they're martyrs or are a 'Good company' who only do nice things for customers because every company has their Light and dark sides whether M$ or Sony BMG's rootkit retardation 5-6 years ago (Especially since it's a different department of Sony, I've only heard stupid things of Sony BMG amongst artists and such) but that alone isn't an excuse to think of Sony as a devil or freedom-stealing company when it's just a damn gaming console, again, it doesn't hinder your life, it doesn't cause you problems, it's a Game console No.1 PS3 for PS3 games, everything else is eyecandy, you can say you won't support Sony or buy their consoles if you dislike their actions against pirates screwing over the industry but that gives no right for people to say they have the Rights and freedoms to steal, pirate free games, break into and code cracks and hacks on the PS3 and cause instabilities amongst the existing community obnoxiously as what's going on.

    Even now people are whining by saying Sony is screwing over PSP1 owners because PSP2 doesn't have UMD, like, Christ, they can't please everyone, lol. Either you buy it or you don't, don't buy it and expect it to give you fucking blowjobs and grant your every wish and desire because you paid for it.

    I bought a house, it doesn't mean I can do whatever I wish in my house, you have to understand responsibilities, doesn't mean I can even dance around naked in my own house with the windows open freely because of laws restricting me(GOD FORBID) for possibily having others see me enjoying myself, same thing. I can't murder or do anything except things that won't fuck over the neighbors, community and etc, I can buy appliances in my home and decorate it but that doesn't give me 100% freedoms in or outside the house 'I BOUGHT', or I'd paint the walls red with the blood of everyone I hated. Fair enough?

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  25. Here, last comment for now, here's an example of what I mean by fools or 'people' exploiting their freedoms.

    My father in-law somehow has an internet plan where he has UNLIMITED bandwidth, he's had that plan for around 8 years now with Bell, do you know what he does with such freedoms of bandwidth and no limitation? He downloads and pirates as many Wii, PS2, PS1 and Xbox games as possible, every day, he is a virtual pack-rat and is compulsively downloading whatever he pleases, he doesn't even own a modded Wii or Xbox, but that doesn't stop him from downloading them and burning them on discs for which he has a giant shelf in the basement containing THOUSANDS of games on blank discs. Why? Because he Can.

    The lesson of today's story is. Just because you CAN, doesn't mean you should. I use pirating personally, only as a means of downloading PC games that have no demos out and I want to try the game before purchasing them, if it sucks, I didn't waste $60 on buying a game that sucked in the end. If it was a good game, I 'Will' buy it to support the growth of the developers who made the game. The truth of that is, majority of people who pirate don't do the same as I do, they will Take and TAKE as much as they wish because they can and Can get away with it irresponsibly.

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  26. ^ Oh yeah, don't forget all the DVD's and Blu-ray movies that he downloads! Lol, he's never been to a theater complex for over 20 years cause he knows he can just pirate all the movies for free!

    :/

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  27. I'll give you a more realistic example then Jason. Lets' say you purchase your shiny new car, and one of the features that they advertise is Cruise Control (and it's one of the reasons you bought the car). At some point in the future, you take the car in for an oil change or some other required service (required to keep your warranty valid), and they disable the cruise control because a small number of drivers are getting into accidents while using it.

    It's a feature that maybe 5% of the drivers use, and maybe 10% of those drivers get into an accident. But, it's a feature that influenced your decision to purchase the car.

    Now, let's say that Autozone offers an OEM-replacement for the cruise control system. Are you saying that you'd live without the cruise control, because the dealer (automaker) decided that it's too dangerous for you, or would you put in the OEM-replacement, because Dammit, that's why you chose that car?

    (for the sake of the argument, let's say that it's one component of the cruise control system that you have to replace, so anyone including a blind grandmother with one arm missing can do it)

    Now... The automaker decides to sue Autozone for providing the component, and they decide to add a valve to the cruise control, which will allow them to shut it off (if the component is reinstalled). Is that right?

    Essentially that's what is happening here. Yes, a small number of people are using the Other OS functionality. But, it WAS THE REASON THEY PURCHASED THE PRODUCT. Sony decided that since an even smaller number of people (read as idiots, if you want) are using it to pirate games or cheat on the network, that they should remove it. The people who purchased the product (and yes they did PURCHASE it) should be compensated for the loss of value. It's not like it depreciated--the value was removed without their consent. You can argue that they didn't have to install the firmware, but in reality they did (if they wanted to continue playing online).

    Hence why there are at least four lawsuits pending about this one issue (not counting the one Sony initiated).

    All of this being said, I don't agree with pirating the games for any reason. And I definitely don't agree with cheating on the network (because some of us are just there to have fun). But, I also don't agree with Sony offering the product and advertising the feature (and then removing it without the consumer's consent).

    In the interest of full disclosure, I DON'T have a PS3/X-Box/Wii/Gaming System of any kind (unless you count an old PC). And I WON'T be purchasing any Sony products (other than possibly a CD or DVD occasionally). I definitely won't be purchasing their consumer electronic products or computers.

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  28. jason would you just get some help and shutup? or do you get payed to spread this sony propaganda bullshit? omg only because you buy a product its not like its really yours. people bought it because sony has released linux for it and years later they decide to remove that feature. can people return their consoles now? no? then just stfu you drm moron.

    oh and: say no to drugs.

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  29. The people who bought the console for the features that were removed, it's a shame, but the havoc being created by those feeling rebellious and angst is comically over-dramatized in the end no matter what :/ Why buy a PS3 just for Other OS and nothing else? It's a silly investment, if people are buying the PS3 which at the top is a Gaming console and a Blu-ray player, for only ONE little feature, then really......I don't know what to say, it's a Gaming Console, not a PC, not a Cheap Linux Computer(though that's what they wished for), buuuut, it's the prioritized thigs like Blu-ray player and PS3 games that won't vanish, PS2 compatibility could be considered a major feature though, and truth be told I never predicted Sony to remove the feature for so long and I expected them to put it back in the Slim models at $299 when it was first shown, just even then, we can't expect prior-console compatibility forever because how the hell can any future-console be compatible with such an architecture such as the Cell? PS1 and PS2 and PS4 might come altogether but unless PS4 runs on the Cell as well just MORE Cell processors or something similar, we'll lose PS3 compatibility on PS4 indefinitely, complaints? Oh yes they'll come as well.

    You make it sound like because the little feature was removed, which was a primary-reason for those few, means that they're like....victimized or rape-victims of corporate bullying of their consumers or something.... Like my comparison of Demon's Souls servers, really its like that. If you buy a product that is pretty complex in its features and Terms of Agreements, far beyond what NES and SNES days were like when it was JUST....For games, Nothing else. You MUST be fully aware that changes, improvements and losses WILL happen or else people are just blinding themselves and being ignorant :\ Crackers/hackers pressuring Sony to make such drastic moves maybe wouldn't be predictable but still, expect the unexpected, it's not like you're taking it up the ass by Sony for them making these moves. :/

    Your 2nd-last paragraph in itself is silly....'Without the consumers consent'? Terms of Agreement am sure would state, which no one ever reads, that they can make any changes they wish to cover for their asses for if any given situation arises that they feel they must make changes, your CONSENT is in the very things you Sign then it goes down to 'If you don't agree to these terms, DON'T BUY IT AND BITCH ABOUT IT LATER ON. It's like being fooled into thinking Redbull gives you wings, so such stories exist where people jump off their houses after drinking a can of it, then suing because they were misled into believing they'd be given wings..... -_- or thinking that because the PS3 ads say 'PS3 only does-Everything' that it really does do literally EVERYTHING....It's in the end, not corporate bullying or unfairness or them stealing something from a product you bought but it's people who ignorantly blind themselves from their responsibilities when they choose to invest their money in a product that they aren't fully aware of what rules come with it, sure! Buy a game, buy a console, skip the ToA and wishfully believe that the ToA will be proper and you wouldn't find a problem within :) Nothing could go wrong :D! . . . Then the CRASH OF REALITY COMES! Then the RAGE! Then the angst rebellious people! Ohhh the cliches of human responses!

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  30. Jailbait is still bad because its Wrongs and flaws do not make up for the Good it brings those who've lost something. I won't argue or yell at 'God' because a family member died and I was told he'd never die or something silly.(Am agnostic anyways).

    That's fine by you, buy Sony's Console for the games, don't be like a bird being teases by shinies and for consumers to do proper research and reading the ToA before purchasing and misleading themselves to believe everything is awwwrrriight. People who bought the PS3 and the top priority ISN'T PS3 games or Blu-ray movies are going to be the silly ones no matter what. PSP2 will be awesome 'if' it gets a good game library, people will bitch cause it doesn't have UMD for all those PSP owners who bought lots of UMD-games unless Sony makes a fix to convert UMD to flash-data or etc and PS4 am sure will be good too. Future is bright for gamers who buy consoles to play games cause I can surely tell you, Sony won't remove PS3's function to play Blu-ray movies and PS3 exclusives.

    Also, of course @Pats, I had responded to the Car-bit of comparison but crappily, the website error'd and I lots my own counter of it.

    Bascically summed up though, its still a bad comparison because your 'Car comparison' is acting as if Autozone is merely there and exists and is offering the replacement as a REPLACEMENT when the reality is that replacement is there to optionally give you back what you lost and THEN.....the other 'features' that comes with the installment are what causes the problems, the Negatives are not overshadowed by the good that Autozone/Jailbreak is offering. It's as if they offer a replacement, THEN the Autozone-fix of the OEM-Replacement then gives you the ability to replace the cars bumpers and tires for free, taillights and sound system and everything, and you can steal bits and pieces of other cars and shove them in your car without paying a dime just to make your car look or seem cooler and more convenient or feature-filled, doesn't make it Right at all.

    If the jailbait just gave back what was lost, compatibility and Other OS, that'd be fine, HOWEVER....this is the reality that jailbait fucks around with game studios and software sales! It cannot be ignored, you can pirate games for free and that is what will be made of it, that is unquestionable whether people lost what was promised or not.

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  31. My example also that was deleted was of course my sad story that is similar of course that I must face and I, as well as the rest of the community won't bitch and whine at the game studio ATLUS.

    Demon's Souls launched with the promise of the awesome innovative online functions, but as everyone read of the ToA, the servers were only up for as long as 30 days, after that Atlus claimed that they would decide legally whether or not they would remove the servers or not varying on the success of the game, well, the game has been out for 1.5 years? and was told the servers would shut down in March 2011! Much more than 30 days, so we, the consumers of the awesome and great game Demon's Souls have experienced what we can make of the game but the reality will be THIS.

    The servers WILL SHUT DOWN, even though it is the most vital part of the game, with the servers down only after 2 years, the game will be rendered Worthless because then you'll not be able to PvP/invade others' worlds, Coop with friends, send and read messages in the world, but be playing a Half-alive game.

    Do I see people crying over this? Yes, people RAGING and threatening Atlus and suing them?! NO. Do I see a band of people finding ways to fuck around with Atlus just so they can play on the game longer? No :/ Though POSITIVELY we have seen 3rd party community members find ways to keep servers alive for games that are long-past dead.

    Demon's Souls losing its servers which will break the game itself, Sony removing little features that won't break the PS3, but we all certainly bought Demon's Souls for ALL the features offered which primarily are linked to Online, which will be gone.

    People don't have to FIGHT IT, nor are we like, bending over and taking it in the ass from Atlus for taking the servers away, be thankful for the experiences before it was taken away :\ I paid $100 for the Limited Edition of Demon's Souls! I 'OWN' the game, but I'm only able to play it for 2 years total, not the rest of my life! Do you hear me angrily taking it out on the company/studio responsible?! Fuck no, it's childish!

    Understand what am saying? Jailbreak is still inexcusable for ITS other-features which do not help the community.

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  32. @Shr00m.

    Lol I really have no words for you, you're too stupid to deal with, especially for even thinking that someone like myself is a 'moron', Hahaha. I can tell even by how YOU type that you're very very intelligent :P So many spelling mistakes and a very insignificant amount of logic or even common sense behind your post....

    'can people return to their consoles, No?' No? Yea....it's called you update the console, play the games and stop being such a little bitch, Kay?

    No, I don't get 'payed', it's merely logic and my frustration at all the delinquents like yourself who feel they deserve everything for nothing. Sony steals your lollipop so you want to burn their house down, very mature from retarded people who can only 'tell' people that they're idiots yet are too stupid and are unable to prove How and Why, evidence is needed to support your silly claims but am sure I don't need to call you stupid for anyone else to realize that fact :/ Made yourself look like an idiot and I have no problem with that, besides, how can you imply I'm high or need help when you're the one with the username of Shr00m? o_O?

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  33. Hey, I bought some milk, it expired cause I didn't drink it all. WTF I SHOULD SUE THE MILK COMPANY FOR MAKING WHAT 'I' OWN....WHAT I BOUGHT, they REMOVED IT FROM ME, NOW I CAN'T FULLY ENJOY MY MILK!!! I WANT MILK THAT LASTS FOREVER OR UNTIL I CHOOSE TO STOP DRINKING IT!

    WHY DID I BUY MILK THAT FUCKING EXPIRES?! I OWN IT SO I SHOULD BE THE ONE TO CHOOSE WHEN IT GOES BAD! GRRRRRRRR!

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  34. @Jason:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-sale_doctrine

    This part of copyright law applies to this. The first sale doctrine states that ownership of an item transfers over to the purchaser on an irrevocable basis. TL;DR: I bought it, it's mine. Leave it alone.

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  35. @Charlie

    We have to come to a point to know that when I say there are Loopholes in the system being exploited, That is why I say such things. Those are old rules that cannot apply to such products coming out these days that are only becoming more and more advanced, it's one-sided to the 'People' and it's being exploited by people like Geohotz who figured that out that they are untouchable and can do as they please.

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  36. @Jason:

    That part of the law still stands. Sony has no right to make unauthorized changes to the console. Making the changes a condition of connecting to PSN would be acceptable to most, I'm sure. Forcing people who don't connect to PSN to make that change just isn't cool. What if I was trying to develop a new PS3 game, and I can't afford the PS3 dev kit? A jailbroken PS3 would suffice just fine, in that case. Publishing the encryption key just makes it easier to actually do this.

    All Sony is trying to do is force someone who paid a lot of money for a PS3 to keep shelling out more for it. Sony didn't learn from a prior mistake involving a rootkit they shipped on a select number of music CDs. The uproar from that caused them to reverse their stance on it. XCP was the name of that particular disaster. All it will take is enough people joining a class action class for Sony to decide to throw in the towel.

    And before you try to say that XCP was their choice, and people had to accept it, most people weren't going to continue to pay for new CD-RW/DVD-R/+R drives all the time due to the rootkit that shipped with certain music CDs.

    While the circumstances are different, the lesson is the same. Once I pay for an item, you do not have a right to tell me how I can use it. You can prevent me from using a network you control, but you can't force me to change how I use something I bought.

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  37. Unauthorized changes to the console? Not allowed to? What?! Lol They're allowed to make changes as they please, it's just the situation where it's a rootkit is what's being questioned more or less.

    Am sure if you designed a console only to have it so your sales got butchered and all your friends pitched in to make games for your console only to have your sales get crippled and for your newly-made studio to go bankrupt because of hackers/crackers and mods being done to your product wouldn't be cool either, would you find it awesome if people messed with something you made for their own gain that'd hinder anothers' gain?

    If I made a game on the PC and prayed for great sales and it was really innovative and awesome, but I only got 50K sales but 500K people were listed to have individually played the game online at some point, making it obvious that 90% of the people playing my game Pirated it so they didn't have to pay an indie developer $10. Would you not blame the pirates? Blame the people who aren't supporting the developers? Then such measures exist where DRM is made to help try to prevent people from doing that crap because its pissing the developers off because people are being selfish and playing their games which they worked hard on making for absolutely nothing! Feel for the devs or companies behind it all for a moment, people are fucking around or playing your game without caring for the consequences. Greed in its purest form, so badly infact that this kind of thing happens:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humble_Indie_Bundle

    The Humble Indie Bundle, a game that cost only One Cent went on where around 25% of the people who played it, were pirates, please read on with that, just an example of how these problems are screwing the industry so really, I just say I understand WHY these companies are making a big deal of crackers/hackers and this with the PS3

    So many companies that aren't as big as Sony have become bankrupt and forced to be bought out or just vanish, because of the rising problems of piracy, jailbait for the PS3 is just another means for people to selfishly get what they want, Sony is merely fighting fire with fire and it's causing sacrifices, how about, if the crackers and hackers STOP, then Sony wouldn't have had to remove the Other OS, why blame Sony 100% for their actions to remove features that caused liabilities?

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  38. The problem with you saying 'What if', is that 'What if' probably wouldn't happen, and is a gigantic minority in comparison to the REAL reason why these jailbaits are going to be used and that is unquestionable.

    If you needed a devkit am sure you'd not have a problem if you were successfully hired by a gaming studio or by any means, whatever most PSN and Indie developers are doing for the PS3. You make it sound as if developers who try to make games on the PS3 are having problems with acquiring PS3 devkits as if they're made of gold and diamonds :/

    How are people shelling out more money to Sony?! I didn't pay extra for the firmware updates or anything, so....what the hell? Shelling out more? How?! The price went down if anything for the things Sony had removed, rofl. Even then, Sony's been losing money Per-sale on every PS3 sold sooooo, yeaaaa.

    I already spoke about the Sony BGM stuff, the difference though being in this and just paranoia is that whatever came with the new firmware is still being decided on what it does, the rootkit on the CD's weren't from Sony's PS3 division, but BGM, and BGM seem like retards as much as SCEE are with advertising the PS3. The difference that we do know of what happened 5-6 years ago was that it effected and fucked your computers and that was Definitely Not Right by all means, THIS on the other case, is for PS3's only and it will not fuck with people who've done nothing wrong so there isn't any fear for those who haven't done anything 'Wrong'. Sony to me is just investing their efforts in keeping the PS3 as hack-free as possible before the end, I, a legit-owner am not effected still :\ The rootkit wouldn't be designed to brick the majority of PS3 owners or Legit-owners, only ones who'll be worried and panicing are the ones who've been pirating, modding their PS3's and I really don't support hackers or pirates because I know they don't do what they do 'For the community', they do it for their own needs while procrastinating the bullshit moralities that are our freedoms, First-Sale doctrine came in what, 1908 did the Wiki say? Clearly it's out-dated and truly it should be updated to the times of products like these that need tighter security measures to prevent a company from needing to do such desperate measures to prevent people from messing with it the way the company doesn't want them to, if a company respectfully says here, enjoy the PS3, but please don't pirate it, you stop and go Hurrrrrrr...Durrr, DURR I KNOW! IMMA DO WHAT I WANT WITH IT! Cause its Mine! So first, you open it up, use it to cook eggs, you take a shit on it(So far so good) but then you HACK IT and start destabilizing the great Balance! Effecting the online features and well-being of the other community members that want to stay legit, hackers are basically not consenting to the desires of the PEOPLE, people seem to be ignoring that..... Rape Sony's console while face-fucking the community who're telling the jailbaiters to fuck off and rooting for Sony to sue the people responsible, not because they're corporate ass-kissers, but because they feel what the jailbaiters are doing are completely unfair and unjust.

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  39. The argument with everyone Pro-hacking and Pro-modding are always going to the same result that it's about Their freedoms, their Rights, why is it always going there, I mean. If it was truly a problem that Sony was fucking over their customers, there would be a bigger uproar and majority would side with the hackers, this isn't the case.

    To me it only feels like people are clinging onto the old rules given to the people for the people, but they're exploiting it and finding the loopholes and taking a giant shit on it because they feel protected by it and invincible, people want to feel the thrill of challenging some company and I have no idea what every individuals' motives are but it's not like everyone feels bullied by Sony's actions as I said :/ Just it always annoyingly goes to the same thing, people complaining about their Rights and freedoms, while doing that, they ignore all means of Right and wrong or logic, I'm not calling Sony as a whole some kind of Saint but I really can't side with people who make bullshit excuses and procrastinate their selfishness all because they feel their rights are being threatened over something so small as a gaming console. I'd go and say people have no right to mod a console as if to say Two wrongs don't make a right, no matter what anyone disputes of Ye Olde Rights, in the end it is This.

    People HACKED and are exploiting a console

    The people who will be the ones to mod their PS3, their goals primarily by doing so are to obtain Free software/games illegally just so they won't have to pay a dime, which in the end is Greed. That then leads to denial of the person saying it's not greed, it's not selfishness and then procrastinating, making a whole spin on their rights to defend themselves when deep down they just are Not in the Right.

    If or easily, when Sony loses the lawsuit against the hackers and jailbait is easily spread amongst MILLIONS of PS3 owners, just go and predict how no one will want to make exclusive games on the PS3 console anymore, exclusivity will worsen, predict also the condition of the gaming market, every year it gets WORSE and worse because of the excuse and over-used 'MY FREEDOMS ARE BEING ATTACKED' scheme.

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  40. @Jason (aka Sony)

    Sony has no legal right to impose a change to a product without the consent of its owner. Pushing (and essentially requiring) firmware that disables a feature cannot be allowed if consent is not requested, and subsequently given. It's the law. If they don't like the law and wish to have it changed, then that is a road they should attempt to take. But, until the law is changed, they have to abide by it. What makes them so special that they can break the law, but they expect pirates to be held accountable by the same set of laws (though I'm not at all saying I think pirates are right)? Ever hear the saying "two wrongs don't make a right"? The fact is, if you break a law to counteract someone breaking a law, you are still breaking the law!

    Sony sold consoles with a "feature" -- whether they knew what they were getting into with it or not. The feature appealed to a certain amount of consumers, which is why it was put in there in the first place -- to draw in the folks that it would appeal to. Those consumers purchased the product either partially or entirely because of the feature. It's no one's place to determine the intended use of the product as a percentage... if someone wanted to purchase it 100% because of the feature and ignore all other "intended" features, that's their right as a consumer. Sony probably only included the feature to separate itself from the competition, in order to ultimately sell more product. Maybe it worked, maybe it didn't, but at least a small population was convinced that the feature made Sony's product more appealing that the competition's offering. That population was not told in advance that they were only renting the feature and that it could/would be removed at any time Sony pleased. That would likely have prevented those sales, which Sony would not have wanted to see. Sony knew what it was doing... sell the console to play PS2 games and with Other OS enabled because it will appeal (sell) to more people -- then pull the plug later and those same people will all just have to deal with it. They again underestimate pissing off hackers. Ignorant people always put hackers and pirates in the same group. Yes, pirates can be hackers and hackers can be pirates, but one does not mean the same thing as the other by itself. Many, if not most, true hackers do not condone or participate in piracy. Sony knew that one way to keep the hackers on its side was through Other OS. It wasn't until the feature was taken away that a true and legitimate attempt to bust the PS3's security needed to be made. Up until that point, PS3 was safe, thanks to Sony's presumably calculated thinking, while the other consoles (without an equivalent Other OS functionality, coincidentally) had long been busted wide open. An argument could be made that if they would have left well alone, their security system would still be intact.

    Point is... don't sell me something based on a list of features, take one or more of those same features away (illegally at that), and then expect me to be happy about it. If you bought a house, with indoor plumbing as a "feature", you'd absolutely be pissed if the builder five years later came and cut your sewer lines because he determined you were polluting rivers where the sewer lines ended with your waste. What? They didn't tell you they could just make changes to your house as they saw fit down the line? Maybe in another five years they come back and determine you use too much electricity, so they force you to buy solar panels or they'll cut your power lines, but you have to buy them from the original builder... any other solar panels won't be acceptable. Essentially, they told everyone "screw you, we don't want you to have that feature anymore... sucks your stuck with it now". They can cripple it as much as they want before I buy it, but once I do, they need my permission to cripple it after the fact.

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  41. @Jason

    You are hilarious! You say people are overreacting on that topic? Look at your posts and see what you just did! A total mess! A mess of words with not the least bit of any understanding what Sony does to their customers.

    If you buy a product, you're the owner of the product itself. This doesn't mean that you own the rights of the intellectual property and can sell it as yours. That are two different things you are mixing together. But you are able to whatever the eff you want with it, even put it in a mixer and cut it into two billion pieces.

    The problem is more common than you might think. Companies in different industries like Music-, Movie-, and Game industry are more and more mixing up the terms "rent" and "buy". If you rent it, the lessor is the owner of intellectual property AND the physical product. This means if you not pay the rent or hand it back, he's able to sue you or whatever. If you buy it, physically, the lessor is NOT the owner of the physical product anymore. BUT STILL the owner of the intellectual property. So in theory Sony is just able to tell you that you have to buy a license if you want to use their intellectual property (That's what they're doing to the game developers, as they're using Sony's proprietary API, the mentioned intellectual property). I mean if you buy a house you are allowed to paint it in every damn color you want. You can remove every damn wall in it if you want, even if the house cracks in - it's yours.

    And now the other thing:
    You say it's just a gaming console, but it isn't. That was Sony's great argument that the PS3 is NOT just a gaming console, but a multimedia center. So you're able to stream video and audio over UPnP, fine, but it supports too less video codecs. The Other OS feature was therefore a good option to put your own UPnP client on it and watch your videos in the damn codecs they are encoded with. Now, because of 0.1% (or even less) of the users they're cutting the features for the rest of the users.

    And now they're coming up with a rootkit that allows them to 'spy' on you. I mean, who tells you for whatever they're gonna use this data?
    I agree with you that you would not have to worry about anything if you just don't do illegal things. But it's a total overkill. A simple example:
    If you buy a house and the seller tells you 'We sell it to you, but we install cameras in there and see every move of you' what would you do? Yes, you would not have to worry about anything because you're a brave man. But do you want them to see you having sex with your wife (if you get any)? I don't think so, because it's your privacy. But this is just another topic.

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  42. Sony have not removed PS2 emulation in any firmware upgrade. That's a feature that was and is present in the early PS3 models to ease the transition from PS2 to PS3 but which were later removed from the product design in newer models when it was deemed the targeted PS2 gamers had already upgraded to PS3, thereby enabling cost cuts in the product price and better positioning the PS3 on the market. And for those PS2 gamers who have not upgraded yet there is plenty of second hand old PS3 units with PS2 emulation available if they desire one.

    Sony did however remove the OtherOS function from the fat PS3 models in a firmware upgrade, and left their users out in cold while doing so, giving them either the choice of loosing the ability to use their PS3 for playing any new games, online games or games they have purchased on PlaystationNetwork or alternatively permanently loosing the OtherOS feature. Additionally due to the DRM features of the PS3 those users do not even have the option to buy a new PS3 for gaming and move their existing content from the old fat PS3 while keeping the fat PS3 at the old OtherOS capable firmware level as moving content between PS3 units require upgrading the firmware which means OtherOS feature will be lost.

    Yes the removal of OtherOS support were apparently in response to XMB hacking performed with assistance by OtherOS, but ironically Sony by removing the OtherOS feature in a forced firmware upgrade indirectly boosted the PS3 firmware hacking community. That community would unboutbly not had been anywhere near where it is today if Sony had not removed the OtherOS feature.

    The only actual effect of removing OtherOS have been that the activity on PS3 firmware hacking increased significantly and many users is seriously pissed off at Sony for removing features they had used or wanted to be able to use some day. It did not by any means stop any firmware hacking, only the opposite.

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  43. Another comment on the rent vs owning discussion.

    I think the renting or owning distinction is pretty clear to everyone by now. Just want to point out what the situation is in the case where you own something.

    From the laws point of view there is conflicting laws regarding what you are allowed to do. In general you are allowed to do pretty much whatever you want for your own personal use with items you own, inclusing disassembling, modding, etc, as long as you do not endanger your own safety. However, in the world of digital content there is the Digital Content Milennium Act which says the opposite by outlawing any activity related to circumvention of digital copy protection mechanisms no matter of trivial those are. This act effectively denies you the freedom of making perfectly legal backups of media content you own and several other activities you are explicitly allowed to perform by copyright and other laws. In the long term it also risks denying you the right to use such content in future as chances are very high you won't be able to move your legally owned content from old nearly worn out devices such as your 15 year old PS3 or ipod for use at another device.

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  44. @Jason again:

    I forgot to mention another topic: You must be god that you hear every console modder saying that his freedom is attacked. You do know that there are a few other people than the console modders? And, more important, you do know that not every modder mekaes use of illegal games? The people you hear complaining are mostly the people that are modding, but not do truly illegal things. They are doing things that are considered by Sony to be illegal, as they just don't want you to do stuff to their product.

    And PS: I assume you had a bad experience in your childhood, because you seem to have a slightly ridiculous antipathy against modders, and users, that want to use thw WHOLE potential of the console...

    Cheers

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  45. @Henrik:

    I agree with you. BUT: Modding the console does not circumvent copy protection. It enables features that aren't enabled. You can play games that aren't approved by Sony and this is not illegal, it's just against the will of Sony. The illegal part of this is making a copy of a game that is copy protected. And then, if you provide it to other people, it's another illegal activity.

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  46. charakters used per user in this discussion:
    Jason: 30291 (57.1%)
    youtube: 3918 (7.4%)
    Andreas Doebeli: 3785 (7.1%)
    Henrik Nordström: 3123 (5.9%)
    PatsComputerServices: 2730 (5.1%)
    hexi: 1948 (3.7%)
    Charles: 1666 (3.1%)
    Trash: 1115 (2.1%)
    Yaddoshi: 690 (1.3%)
    arkwald: 651 (1.2%)
    AndreBoll: 600 (1.1%)
    MegaMOK: 517 (1.0%)
    sHR00m: 380 (0.7%)
    kevin: 371 (0.7%)
    Mark: 340 (0.6%)
    tepples: 219 (0.4%)
    Gary: 192 (0.4%)
    Merle: 136 (0.3%)
    John: 117 (0.2%) #excluding this post :)
    Gão: 103 (0.2%)
    Init: 97 (0.2%)
    Jonne: 78 (0.1%)
    James: 16 (0.0%)

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  47. Sorry Andreas, I was too busy reading an intelligent post that was made from Henrik, your post smelled of 'fail-troll' and garbage so I ignored it unlike everyone elses post so far, your personality smells stubborn and rotten and perhaps thick-skulled from my experiences of dealing with people who start their post the way you do, mostly 'sarcastic and full of yourself' if not also highly opinionated in a silly way so I don't feel the need to bother with your flawed berating methods :/

    @Henrik, so what do you personally see is the 'Right' side? What are the pros and cons to the situation of Sony vs 'Hackers' and such? This dilemma is probably going to end the same as it did with Apple vs Hackers, but the iPhone is sorta miniscule in comparison to something like a console to me, a phone that relies heavily on features and community apps is pretty much what it is so the severeness may be lessened but, nonetheless as long as it doesn't effect those 'Online' which it really doesn't since its just a phone and such unlike a PS3 with software sales an online communities that have to be worried over like the huge amount of hackers that're apparent in COD games(Yea, they're everyone on all platforms but I heard PS3's pretty bad if not worse, no proof to back that up though)

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  48. @John

    What can I say John? I have a lot to say and clearly a great way to express my mind to the fullest amount of the English language without any stuttering to my thoughts and cognitive ability :P Tomorrow I may not respond as much though since of the blizzard and shoveling and life-responsibilities outside of debating online joyously...

    :P

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  49. @Jason:

    Thanks for the proof that you are no different. Most of your contribution here was to throw everyone in one pot and show your antipathy in a very theatrical way, not to forget that your flaming everyone that does not agree with you. Very constructive, yes.

    You made us understand that you actually hate the kiddies that are complaining that "Sony is stealin our freedomz". But you know what? To me, you seem to be the same kid shouting "Just shuts the f*ck up and taek wat you gets".

    But nice we talked about that. I'm off here.

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  50. what i think IS a problem is that hackers do sonys dirty work in finding loopholes, so they dont have to do that work on the ps4. when it took half a year to hack a console it takes 5 years now. this isnt gonna get better. in the end its a win win for sony and a clear loss for open consoles. sony are a bunch of crybabies.

    the majority still buys a game that deserves it. no matter if its on pc or a console. if the game is a stupid hype, pooly done, has major bugs people might "pirate" it, play it for a while. throw it away and never would have bought it in the first place. its like with cinema. im not gonna pay for a bad movie either. nor can i pay for a movie if i cant afford it. wheres the damage in that? welcome to the 21st century, where people dont pay for crap anymore.

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  51. @Andreas

    lol, I love how you try hard to force down your mere 'Opinion' onto others without any evidence behind it but mere assumptions and your failure of over-analyzing things, the problem is you can't successfully analyze people or situations as you're attempting, when you don't have intelligence to back it up. :)

    With that you already show your immaturity by doing the cliched "I'm going to have the last say in this then run away before you counter what I say with something".

    Kids like you need to learn your place is all if I may say so without you having a tempertantrum, or in this situation with your illogical nature towards me, Haters gonna hate. Just try learning how to use common sense properly next time, your sense of deduction is horrible. Especially since everything I said hours/days ago already discussed everything you try to bring up especially of 'just shutup and take it' as I said it's not 'Corporate bullying' of customers like fools such as yourself will believe, but oh boohoooo, you're such a victimized little boy aren't you :( ...

    Go cry somewhere else pleaaaase, you're just adding fuel to the drama with an illogical but forever-perpetuating amount of garbage, rofl.

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  52. @Jason:

    Personal attacks such as what you're posting just lead to people discrediting what you have to say, as it shows everyone what you are. Congrats on a reasonably effective troll.

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  53. @Shr00m

    Well, it took 4-5'ish years to hack the PS3 yea, but it didn't even take a month for the 360 to be hacked, so its not that through the years of more and newer consoles that come out that it takes a longer time for the consoles to be hacked but yea, Sony does use the experiences they learn from the hackers to help make it harder to hack, PSP was hacked with ease and Sony used that knowledge to help keep PS3 as un-hacked as possible, their mistake was then here, allowing Other OS to be a feature, a mistake they won't do on PS4 obviously, it'd be a bit more of a stricter console.

    Majority sorta buys the game in the end, but it is much worse for PC-gaming where pirates derive in moreso, even if for example you look at what EA gave everyone of their financial losses due to the rise of pirating, it's pretty sad. The past few years EA has been REALLY publishing or making really great games due to the studios they possess, especially enjoying Dead Space 2 but, sales for Dead Space 1 and 2 for PC aren't going to be nice at all.

    Pirates fighting against unlawful and pathetic DRM like what EA had done with Spore and Ubisoft even, is fine and dandy since they were truly robbing peoples rights in the most obvious fashion that if you could only install the game a certain amount of times and with Ubisoft, you had to be connected Online or else you can't play the game so if the internet went down or you'd want to play offline for any reason, you're fucked, can't play or your game would instantly shut down if internet connection is lost, it was completely one-sided and unfair so I wouldn't side with Ubi or EA in those events in comparison to how I am siding with Sony on this and not the people fighting them.

    Digital distribution keeps getting closer and closer but I only wonder if there will be a sure way to ensure a competent security measure that doesn't restrict consumers but protects the product from being tampered with, it's a complex future for both parties to deal with.

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  54. @Charles

    Such perceptions are for the narrow-minded, if people go so far as to jump to conclusions about someone based on a retaliation to a person that do not in any way relate to themselves, it shouldn't effect them in any way unless they're a fool. I react and respond to everyone neutrally unless they provoke a different response, not everyone are equals but to start judgmentally jumping at someones throat and saying that ones words against another discredits them for trivial reasons as that, then I don't care what they think of me, society runs too strongly on others perceptions and 'beliefs' that someones a bad man cause they did that and this. My positives on the topic far outweighs the amount that I've been berating people like Andreas who only is saying what he is to get a rise out of someone, it's not that I'm trolling, but countering the troll before he has a chance, fighting fire with fire, simple as that :/

    Not as if I'm going to steal a babies lollipop, kick a baby seal in the face and then give $1 million dollars to the Red Cross and say NAW I'm more nice than I am evil :) Moreso I just kicked a rat in the face, rats aren't as cuteas baby seals and aren't as delicious as lollipops from the innocence of the youth :P Lol.....

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  55. @john
    haha statistics of the sony ad hominem massacre
    lets calm things down here.

    in my opinion (which is probably worthless at this point..but what the hell), if i had a client who paid me for some logo system or something like that, i do the job and do it well to the satisfaction of the customer as advertised and in agreement.

    same as if i order a meal and the chef cooks me a fabulous meal. i eat it no strings attached.

    it's basic business and sadly sony defies that trust by giving us a product and later modifying the product by taking away features. sure, there are exploiters out there and sony is trying to protect their bottom line from them...but at the risk of destroying the public consumer's rights ? im sure there's better ways out there than deploying rootkits....

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  56. @ejunker

    Is fair enough to say it is bad that companies result in taking actions that effect the 'innocent' consumers all because of a group of others who're screwing around with things when if they hadn't, all would be fine.

    If you yourself could think of a better alternative though for what Sony should do to boost the securities and not remove any features/freedoms and liabilities, what would you do as say if you were a Sony employee and it was your job to make a way to create a patch that would prevent hackers from exploiting the PS3 for 6+ months or a year and more? If anyone can think of a great idea that would work and wouldn't take a few days to basically break it down, then am sure they should get hired by Sony to do such things, lol.

    It's why in many circumstances, Microsoft in the past have Hired people who've hacked Windows so that they will pay the hackers to work with Microsoft to doing the opposite on their OS and making it more secure, maybe if anything, Sony should try hiring Geohotz and put him to use of doing the opposite instead of attacking him and making the annoying trolls take it as a 'Challenge' and do more damage, lol.

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